Need small programming languages

Dos-Man 64 <ChairShot DeleteThis @mail.com> writes:

[...]

> I'm looking for something that would be similar to rapiq-q

http://www.telefonica.net/web2/rq/WiYu/Download.htm

The compiler still works on the current Debian stable and at least
the example mentioned in the README seems to do so, to.

in 6978 20090814 175331 Dos-Man 64 <ChairShot.DeleteThis@mail.com> wrote:

>3) Not a huge package with millions of files and a full-scale ide and
>whatnot. I tried downloading free pascal, but it's just too much of a
>monster to download and configure.

Free Pascal binaries install in seconds and no configuration is necessary.

On Aug 15, 1:18 am, Bob Martin <bob.mar... RemoveThis @excite.com> wrote:
> in 6978 20090814 175331 Dos-Man 64 <ChairS... RemoveThis @mail.com> wrote:
>
> >3)  Not a huge package with millions of files and a full-scale ide and
> >whatnot. I tried downloading free pascal, but it's just too much of a
> >monster to download and configure.
>
> Free Pascal binaries install in seconds and no configuration is necessary..


I'm using a live distrubtion, meaning it would probably have to be
installed over and over again. Also, I need to download and install
the lazarus IDE, another monster. And the target machine has no
internet connection. I need to download the stuff manually. I'm just
not having any luck with any of them. Usually I can't even figure out
what files to download from these huge lists of downloadable files
with no descriptions. I need something smaller and easier to work
with.

On Aug 15, 10:33 am, John Hasler <j....DeleteThis@dhh.gt.org> wrote:
> Dos-Man 64 writes:
> > I'm using a live distrubtion...
>
> Why?  Those are not intended for anything serious.


Well, that may be true; however, I am finding knoppix live to be
totally sufficient for what I want to do here. I've been using Windows
98 for like 12 years, and this is similar. It's at least as good. All
I need now is a couple of good little compilers, and I'll be set.


>
> > And the target machine has no internet connection.
>
> Why?  Even I can afford a Realtek card.
>


We have two machines in our household. One is set up for Internet, the
other has always been used for gaming.


> > Usually I can't even figure out what files to download from these huge
> > lists of downloadable files with no descriptions.
>
> Install a real distribution such as Debian and then install one of the
> numerous IDE packages it offers (Lazarus for Free Pascal, for example).
> The package manager will figure out all the dependencies.  All you will
> have to do is change CDs when told to (and not even that if you spend
> $10 and put the machine on the Net).
> --
> John Hasler
> j....DeleteThis@dhh.gt.org
> Dancing Horse Hill
> Elmwood, WI USA


I still have a problem with that. Stuff disappears (kylix for
example.) If I download something, I want to be able to burn it to a
CD so that I will always have it. If something requires too many
dependencies and too much downloading, then it isn't any good and not
worth bothering with. Well, that's the philosophy of the platform I am
coming from anyway.

Dos-Man 64 writes:
> I'm using a live distrubtion...

Why? Those are not intended for anything serious.

> And the target machine has no internet connection.

Why? Even I can afford a Realtek card.

> Usually I can't even figure out what files to download from these huge
> lists of downloadable files with no descriptions.

Install a real distribution such as Debian and then install one of the
numerous IDE packages it offers (Lazarus for Free Pascal, for example).
The package manager will figure out all the dependencies. All you will
have to do is change CDs when told to (and not even that if you spend
$10 and put the machine on the Net).
--
John Hasler
john.DeleteThis@dhh.gt.org
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI USA

On 2009-08-14, Dos-Man 64 <ChairShot DeleteThis @mail.com> wrote:
> Hello, I am now finally moving to linux from windows. I am ok with
> using Linux, but I do not know much about what programming tools are
> available. What I am looking for is some programming tools that meet
> a few specific criteria.
>
> 1) Easy to download/install/configure on a debian distribution. In
> other words, not requiring me to download a bunch of other stuff in
> order to get said compiler to work.

you could try NASM (I'm not really sure of your goals here)

> 2) Standalone executables. I'm just not a big fan of the whole .net/
> java thing. I want stand-alone binaries (and preferably small ones.)

gcc (and a few extra bits) will compile C,C++, ISO Pascal, Object
Pascal, Fortran-78, Objective C, and probably a few other languages.
it's kind of big but it works well.

> 3) Not a huge package with millions of files and a full-scale ide and
> whatnot. I tried downloading free pascal, but it's just too much of a
> monster to download and configure.

> I'm looking for something that would be similar to rapiq-q or AutoIt 3
> on the windows platform. Just something that is easy to set up and can
> be used to create small utilities with.

wikipedia says rapiq-q is cross platform, get the linux version!

I usually write small utilities as bash scripts.

On Aug 16, 6:08 am, markhob... RemoveThis @hotpop.donottypethisbit.com (Mark
Hobley) wrote:
> Dos-Man 64 <ChairS... RemoveThis @mail.com> wrote:
> > Well, that may be true; however, I am finding knoppix live to be
> > totally sufficient for what I want to do here. I've been using Windows
> > 98 for like 12 years, and this is similar.
>
> Yeah, but do you run windows from a livecd?
> The advice of using a permanent distro for development is good.


No. And that is the problem! Windows has become so bloated, so non-
versatile... it's essentially a software anville composed of binary
digits. The problem is only getting worse and worse. Vista is a
complete resource hog, and also very nosy as to who you are and what
you are doing. These little linux distros are very acrobatic and
versatile. And they don't ask too many questions.


>
> I too am a developer coming from another platform (my background is
> msdos and assembly language).
>
> > It's at least as good. All
> > I need now is a couple of good little compilers, and I'll be set.
>
> I am doing similar research here. For graphical applications, you might want
> to try gambas, which is a bit like visual basic.
>


I haven't heard of that. I will try it. Thank you for the suggestion.


> > We have two machines in our household. One is set up for Internet, the
> > other has always been used for gaming.
>
> Ok, you have more than one machine. That is a good reason to get hold of
> a couple of network cards.

Well, the machine upstairs does a NIC, but it just doesn't have a
line. The NIC was put in so that I can pass files back and forth to
my softmodded xboxes.


>
> > I still have a problem with that. Stuff disappears (kylix for
> > example.)  If I download something, I want to be able to burn it to a
> > CD so that I will always have it.
>
> Indeed, distributions do change. Burning to cdrom, or storing stuff on a
> local fileserver is a good policy. I do that here.
>
> > If something requires too many
> > dependencies and too much downloading, then it isn't any good and not
> > worth bothering with. Well, that's the philosophy of the platform I am
> > coming from anyway.
>
> Microsoft Windows has problems with dependencies too. You must have
> experienced this.


Well, it's getting worse with the whole .NET thingy, but I've not
really dealt with that. That is exactly why I have stuck with '98.

Dos-Man 64 <ChairShot.DeleteThis@mail.com> wrote:
> Well, that may be true; however, I am finding knoppix live to be
> totally sufficient for what I want to do here. I've been using Windows
> 98 for like 12 years, and this is similar.

Yeah, but do you run windows from a livecd?
The advice of using a permanent distro for development is good.

I too am a developer coming from another platform (my background is
msdos and assembly language).

> It's at least as good. All
> I need now is a couple of good little compilers, and I'll be set.

I am doing similar research here. For graphical applications, you might want
to try gambas, which is a bit like visual basic.

> We have two machines in our household. One is set up for Internet, the
> other has always been used for gaming.

Ok, you have more than one machine. That is a good reason to get hold of
a couple of network cards.

> I still have a problem with that. Stuff disappears (kylix for
> example.) If I download something, I want to be able to burn it to a
> CD so that I will always have it.

Indeed, distributions do change. Burning to cdrom, or storing stuff on a
local fileserver is a good policy. I do that here.

> If something requires too many
> dependencies and too much downloading, then it isn't any good and not
> worth bothering with. Well, that's the philosophy of the platform I am
> coming from anyway.

Microsoft Windows has problems with dependencies too. You must have
experienced this.

FWIW, I am working on a distribution that will build entirely from an archive of
source tarballs, senabling the software to be kept under local control.
(Apparently openbsd has better support for this). Unfortunately on Linux, the
GNU toolchain is currently required, but this is broken at this time, so I
have not yet been able to get a similar system operational.

Mark.

--
Mark Hobley
Linux User: #370818 http://markhobley.yi.org/

On Aug 16, 4:28 am, Jasen Betts <ja....TakeThisOut@xnet.co.nz> wrote:
> On 2009-08-14, Dos-Man 64 <ChairS....TakeThisOut@mail.com> wrote:
>
> > Hello, I am now finally moving to linux from windows. I am ok with
> > using Linux, but I do not know much about what programming tools are
> > available.  What I am looking for is some programming tools that meet
> > a few specific criteria.
>
> > 1)  Easy to download/install/configure on a debian distribution.  In
> > other words, not requiring me to download a bunch of other stuff in
> > order to get said compiler to work.
>
> you could try NASM (I'm not really sure of your goals here)
>



Well, my goal is to get more comfortable using and programming linux.
I know C very well, and so I'm ok on the command line application
front. I just need something small for writing GUI apps. As mentioned,
I do not like java. I have used linux on and off over the years, so
I'm not in the position of having no linux experience at all (Thank
God.) But then again, there's a lot that I don't know, so I have to
continue to learn.


> > 2)  Standalone executables.  I'm just not a big fan of the whole .net/
> > java thing. I want stand-alone binaries (and preferably small ones.)
>
> gcc (and a few extra bits) will compile C,C++, ISO Pascal, Object
> Pascal, Fortran-78, Objective C, and probably a few other languages.
> it's kind of big but it works well.
>
> > 3)  Not a huge package with millions of files and a full-scale ide and
> > whatnot. I tried downloading free pascal, but it's just too much of a
> > monster to download and configure.
> > I'm looking for something that would be similar to rapiq-q or AutoIt 3
> > on the windows platform. Just something that is easy to set up and can
> > be used to create small utilities with.
>
> wikipedia says rapiq-q is cross platform, get the linux version!
>


Honestly, I have tried it. It doesn't work well. It isn't reliable.


> I usually write small utilities as bash scripts.


My own scripting language seems to work pretty well running under WINE
(or at least for scripts that don't perform console I/O.) However,
this is kind of a bizarre experience running this (to say the least.)

http://www.savefile.com/client/files.php?pid=808766665

On Sun, 16 Aug 2009 07:25:37 -0700 (PDT), Dos-Man 64
<ChairShot.TakeThisOut@mail.com> wrote:

>On Aug 16, 4:28 am, Jasen Betts <ja....TakeThisOut@xnet.co.nz> wrote:
>> On 2009-08-14, Dos-Man 64 <ChairS....TakeThisOut@mail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > Hello, I am now finally moving to linux from windows. I am ok with
>> > using Linux, but I do not know much about what programming tools are
>> > available.  What I am looking for is some programming tools that meet
>> > a few specific criteria.
>>
>> > 1)  Easy to download/install/configure on a debian distribution.  In
>> > other words, not requiring me to download a bunch of other stuff in
>> > order to get said compiler to work.
>>
>> you could try NASM (I'm not really sure of your goals here)
>>
>
>
>
>Well, my goal is to get more comfortable using and programming linux.
>I know C very well, and so I'm ok on the command line application
>front. I just need something small for writing GUI apps. As mentioned,
>I do not like java. I have used linux on and off over the years, so
>I'm not in the position of having no linux experience at all (Thank
>God.) But then again, there's a lot that I don't know, so I have to
>continue to learn.
>
>
>> > 2)  Standalone executables.  I'm just not a big fan of the whole .net/
>> > java thing. I want stand-alone binaries (and preferably small ones.)
>>
>> gcc (and a few extra bits) will compile C,C++, ISO Pascal, Object
>> Pascal, Fortran-78, Objective C, and probably a few other languages.
>> it's kind of big but it works well.
>>
>> > 3)  Not a huge package with millions of files and a full-scale ide and
>> > whatnot. I tried downloading free pascal, but it's just too much of a
>> > monster to download and configure.
>> > I'm looking for something that would be similar to rapiq-q or AutoIt 3
>> > on the windows platform. Just something that is easy to set up and can
>> > be used to create small utilities with.
>>
>> wikipedia says rapiq-q is cross platform, get the linux version!
>>
>
>
>Honestly, I have tried it. It doesn't work well. It isn't reliable.
>
>
>> I usually write small utilities as bash scripts.
>
>
>My own scripting language seems to work pretty well running under WINE
>(or at least for scripts that don't perform console I/O.) However,
>this is kind of a bizarre experience running this (to say the least.)
>
>http://www.savefile.com/client/files.php?pid=808766665

Late to the chase here, but two suggestions:

Build your own live DVD with Kdevelop (it may even be on the Knoppix
DVD)

Search Internet for a live DVD with development tools on it already.

On Sep 26, 11:19 am, "JosephKK"<quiettechb....RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Sun, 16 Aug 2009 07:25:37 -0700 (PDT), Dos-Man 64
>
>
>
>
>
> <ChairS....RemoveThis@mail.com> wrote:
> >On Aug 16, 4:28 am, Jasen Betts <ja....RemoveThis@xnet.co.nz> wrote:
> >> On 2009-08-14, Dos-Man 64 <ChairS....RemoveThis@mail.com> wrote:
>
> >> > Hello, I am now finally moving to linux from windows. I am ok with
> >> > using Linux, but I do not know much about what programming tools are
> >> > available.  What I am looking for is some programming tools that meet
> >> > a few specific criteria.
>
> >> > 1)  Easy to download/install/configure on a debian distribution.  In
> >> > other words, not requiring me to download a bunch of other stuff in
> >> > order to get said compiler to work.
>
> >> you could try NASM (I'm not really sure of your goals here)
>
> >Well, my goal is to get more comfortable using and programming linux.
> >I know C very well, and so I'm ok on the command line application
> >front. I just need something small for writing GUI apps. As mentioned,
> >I do not like java. I have used linux on and off over the years, so
> >I'm not in the position of having no linux experience at all (Thank
> >God.) But then again, there's a lot that I don't know, so I have to
> >continue to learn.
>
> >> > 2)  Standalone executables.  I'm just not a big fan of the whole .net/
> >> > java thing. I want stand-alone binaries (and preferably small ones.)
>
> >> gcc (and a few extra bits) will compile C,C++, ISO Pascal, Object
> >> Pascal, Fortran-78, Objective C, and probably a few other languages.
> >> it's kind of big but it works well.
>
> >> > 3)  Not a huge package with millions of files and a full-scale ide and
> >> > whatnot. I tried downloading free pascal, but it's just too much of a
> >> > monster to download and configure.
> >> > I'm looking for something that would be similar to rapiq-q or AutoIt 3
> >> > on the windows platform. Just something that is easy to set up and can
> >> > be used to create small utilities with.
>
> >> wikipedia says rapiq-q is cross platform, get the linux version!
>
> >Honestly, I have tried it.  It doesn't work well.  It isn't reliable..
>
> >> I usually write small utilities as bash scripts.
>
> >My own scripting language seems to work pretty well running under WINE
> >(or at least for scripts that don't perform console I/O.)  However,
> >this is kind of a bizarre experience running this (to say the least.)
>
> >http://www.savefile.com/client/files.php?pid=808766665
>
> Late to the chase here, but two suggestions:
>
> Build your own live DVD with Kdevelop (it may even be on the Knoppix
> DVD)
>
> Search Internet for a live DVD with development tools on it already.


Actually, I'm doing OK right now. I ordered some knoppix DVDs and
there are some good options here including Free Pascal and GTK+. I
just finished my first utility.

http://groups.google.com/group/linuxusersgroup/browse_thread/thread/a6...a127112

I've had some trouble with QT. I haven't been able to get any of the
programs in any of the books I bought to compile. I don't think the
QT library is installed, but the weird thing that is I got a KDE
application to compile from kdevelop. Right now I am trying to stay
away from IDEs, make files, projects, etc. I just want to keep things
simple. Just me, gedit, and a source code file. That's the best way
to learn.