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Florian Weimer

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Since: Nov 29, 2006
Posts: 152



(Msg. 16) Posted: Sat Jan 10, 2009 5:20 am
Post subject: Re: enabling transport and on storage encryption in bacula on debian build [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: linux>debian>legal (more info?)

* Kern Sibbald:

> Problems of mismatched licenses apparently occur when forming and
> distributing a "mixed" binary program or when mixing different
> licenced source code in the same file and distributing it. As far
> as I know Bacula 2.4.x does not mix source code with different
> licenses in the same source file (we simply call libraries that when
> executed are incompatible), and Debian as well as its derivatives
> have decided not to form a Bacula binary using the offending
> libraries.

Some folks claim that merely referencing a dynamic shared object makes
a program a derived work of the dynamic shared object. In my opinion,
this is an argument based on an extensionist copyright policy, and I
therefore reject it. However, something like this is necessary to
preserve the self-enforcing nature of the various GPL versions for
dynamic shared objects (and other library code which is only
incorporated per reference). As a result, the
derived-work-by-reference concept has several prominent followers,
including the FSF.

The OpenSSL situation is special because it's the only relict of the
old BSD-vs-GPL fight which is still relevant. It's a real shame that
this was not solved in the GPL renewal process, but this was
predictable. But it still hurts that the FSF does not want us to ship
software released under the GPL which uses the OpenSSL library, but
has no problem with proprietary software vendors shipping compiled
third-party programs licensed under the GPL which are linked to
proprietary system libraries, perhaps even including a copy of
OpenSSL. There is something seriously wrong about this.

In short, I share your frustration, but I also think that the John's
decision is quite reasonable.


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MJ Ray

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Since: Mar 11, 2007
Posts: 148



(Msg. 17) Posted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 9:20 am
Post subject: Re: enabling transport and on storage encryption in bacula on debian build [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Hendrik Weimer <hendrik DeleteThis @enyo.de> wrote:
> It is a fact that Debian more often rejects packages present in other
> distros than the other way around. Which I believe is a good sign,
> BTW.

Is that a fact? Where's the evidence? A quick web search didn't find
a good study, but it might exist. I found some evidence that Debian
rejects packages present in Ubuntu, but that's a special case and only
one related distribution.

Even if so, how does one get from that fact to "Debian's policy on
licensing usually involves taking the high road..."?

I am subscribed to debian-legal - no need to cc me.

Thanks,
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MJR/slef
My Opinion Only: see http://people.debian.org/~mjr/
Please follow http://www.uk.debian.org/MailingLists/#codeofconduct


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George Danchev

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Since: Dec 24, 2006
Posts: 74



(Msg. 18) Posted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 9:20 am
Post subject: Re: enabling transport and on storage encryption in bacula on debian build [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

On Sunday 11 January 2009 15:22:25 MJ Ray wrote:
> Hendrik Weimer <hendrik RemoveThis @enyo.de> wrote:
> > It is a fact that Debian more often rejects packages present in other
> > distros than the other way around. Which I believe is a good sign,
> > BTW.
>
> Is that a fact? Where's the evidence? A quick web search didn't find
> a good study, but it might exist.

I doubt there is such a stufy, but you may want to look at the recently
uploaded 'whohas' package, and ask it for some possibly problematic
packagenames to see whether any other distro has it.

> I found some evidence that Debian
> rejects packages present in Ubuntu, but that's a special case and only
> one related distribution.

.... like codeblocks package for example, which got recently rejected in NEW,
but I'm not sure exactly why, though code dups and unfinished
debian/copyright might be the reasoning behind that.

--
pub 4096R/0E4BD0AB 2003-03-18 <people.fccf.net/danchev/key pgp.mit.edu>


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Hendrik Weimer

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Since: Nov 24, 2008
Posts: 5



(Msg. 19) Posted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 5:20 pm
Post subject: Re: enabling transport and on storage encryption in bacula on debian build [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

MJ Ray <mjr.DeleteThis@phonecoop.coop> writes:

> Hendrik Weimer <hendrik.DeleteThis@enyo.de> wrote:
>> It is a fact that Debian more often rejects packages present in other
>> distros than the other way around. Which I believe is a good sign,
>> BTW.
>
> Is that a fact? Where's the evidence? A quick web search didn't find
> a good study, but it might exist. I found some evidence that Debian
> rejects packages present in Ubuntu, but that's a special case and only
> one related distribution.

A list of packages that have or had license issues from the top of my
head: gnucash (HBCI support), kmymoney2 (HBCI support),
ttf-liberation, bacula (encryption), libapache-mod-security. The only
case I am aware of where another distro refuses to distribute a
package found in Debian is Fedora's stance on afio. If you know of
other cases, I would be interested to learn about them.

> Even if so, how does one get from that fact to "Debian's policy on
> licensing usually involves taking the high road..."?

I would claim that said fact presents evidence that this statement is
true. But again, I do not see a problem with this.

Hendrik


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Simon Josefsson

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Since: Nov 29, 2006
Posts: 27



(Msg. 20) Posted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 5:20 pm
Post subject: Re: enabling transport and on storage encryption in bacula on debian build [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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Josselin Mouette <joss DeleteThis @debian.org> writes:

> Le dimanche 11 janvier 2009 Á  21:25 +0100, Hendrik Weimer a Á©crit :
>> The only
>> case I am aware of where another distro refuses to distribute a
>> package found in Debian is Fedora's stance on afio. If you know of
>> other cases, I would be interested to learn about them.
>
> There's also the case of MP3 decoders in Red hat.

And SRP authentication in GnuTLS, unless that changed recently. There
is some discussion on this in:

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ForbiddenItems

/Simon


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Hendrik Weimer

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Since: Nov 24, 2008
Posts: 5



(Msg. 21) Posted: Mon Jan 12, 2009 3:20 pm
Post subject: Re: enabling transport and on storage encryption in bacula on debian build [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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Josselin Mouette <joss DeleteThis @debian.org> writes:

> Le dimanche 11 janvier 2009 à 21:25 +0100, Hendrik Weimer a écrit :
>> The only
>> case I am aware of where another distro refuses to distribute a
>> package found in Debian is Fedora's stance on afio. If you know of
>> other cases, I would be interested to learn about them.
>
> There’s also the case of MP3 decoders in Red hat.

That's patents rather than copyright. When it comes to patent issues I
agree that Debian has a fairly lax (and informal) policy.

Hendrik


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