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Next: ARP entry not getting removed
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Since: Nov 22, 2006
Posts: 11
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(Msg. 1) Posted: Sat Sep 15, 2007 4:50 pm
Post subject: Recent Linux PDA?
Archived from groups: comp>sys>handhelds, others (more info?)
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I've been using a Sharp Zaurus SL-5000D and then a SL-5500 for years,
currently running OpenZaurus 3.5.3 (kernel 2.4.1  and Opie 1.2.1. It's
been excellent, providing pretty much all I have needed so far
(calendar/contacts, browser, mailer, IR, wifi/bluetooth/RJ45 card,
terminal, editor, Java, and LaTeX).
But it won't last forever, and I'm now interested in something similar
but faster and with more storage and memory. Unfortunately, the market
seems to be stagnant for Linux on PDAs, and all the web pages I can find
mention either Sharp's more recent (and physically much larger) systems
(still without wifi/bluetooth) running their own Linux kludge, or
non-native Linux hacked onto old WinCE/Palm/etc PDAs, or a MilSpec
ruggedized device for $1500+
Is there *any* RECENT (2007) affordable and (preferably) native Linux
PDA along similar lines to the SL5500 that isn't corporately crippled? I
don't mind replacing a non-Linux OS with a port of Linux, provided that
the port is stable and has similar support to how OZ/Opie worked (for a
time).
I'm not in Japan 
///Peter |
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External
Since: May 12, 2007
Posts: 45
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(Msg. 2) Posted: Sat Sep 15, 2007 6:16 pm
Post subject: Re: Recent Linux PDA? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Peter Flynn wrote:
> I've been using a Sharp Zaurus SL-5000D and then a SL-5500 for years,
> currently running OpenZaurus 3.5.3 (kernel 2.4.1 and Opie 1.2.1. It's
> been excellent, providing pretty much all I have needed so far
> (calendar/contacts, browser, mailer, IR, wifi/bluetooth/RJ45 card,
> terminal, editor, Java, and LaTeX).
>
> But it won't last forever, and I'm now interested in something similar
> but faster and with more storage and memory. Unfortunately, the market
> seems to be stagnant for Linux on PDAs, and all the web pages I can find
> mention either Sharp's more recent (and physically much larger) systems
> (still without wifi/bluetooth) running their own Linux kludge, or
> non-native Linux hacked onto old WinCE/Palm/etc PDAs, or a MilSpec
> ruggedized device for $1500+
>
> Is there *any* RECENT (2007) affordable and (preferably) native Linux
> PDA along similar lines to the SL5500 that isn't corporately crippled? I
> don't mind replacing a non-Linux OS with a port of Linux, provided that
> the port is stable and has similar support to how OZ/Opie worked (for a
> time).
>
> I'm not in Japan
>
Nokia? The N800. |
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External
Since: Feb 28, 2005
Posts: 3
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(Msg. 3) Posted: Sat Sep 15, 2007 6:16 pm
Post subject: Re: Recent Linux PDA? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Chris Cox <notccox.TakeThisOut@notairmail.net> writes:
> Nokia? The N800.
That is a cute device but not really a PDA. It's more like a tiny
handheld laptop. When you turn it on, the OS boots, then the window
system boots, and then you're in your starting window configuration
with no apps running, as if you had just booted a workstation. I
think of PDA as meaning you that can turn the thing off with
applications active, and when you turn it back on, you're in the same
state as before with the same stuff on the screen.
That said, if you want a tiny little Linux computer, the Nokias are
sure cool. The earlier N770 model shows up on closeout for $125 or so. |
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External
Since: Sep 16, 2007
Posts: 1
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(Msg. 4) Posted: Sat Sep 15, 2007 7:10 pm
Post subject: Re: Recent Linux PDA? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On 15 Sep., 22:50, Peter Flynn <peter.n....TakeThisOut@m.silmaril.ie> wrote:
> I've been using a Sharp Zaurus SL-5000D and then a SL-5500 for years,
> currently running OpenZaurus 3.5.3 (kernel 2.4.1 and Opie 1.2.1. It's
> been excellent, providing pretty much all I have needed so far
> (calendar/contacts, browser, mailer, IR, wifi/bluetooth/RJ45 card,
> terminal, editor, Java, and LaTeX).
>
> But it won't last forever, and I'm now interested in something similar
> but faster and with more storage and memory. Unfortunately, the market
> seems to be stagnant for Linux on PDAs, and all the web pages I can find
> mention either Sharp's more recent (and physically much larger) systems
> (still without wifi/bluetooth) running their own Linux kludge, or
> non-native Linux hacked onto old WinCE/Palm/etc PDAs, or a MilSpec
> ruggedized device for $1500+
If you want a device with keyboard, there is no alternative to a
Sharp SL-C1000 or SL-C3200. Although they are physically larger and
have
no (builtin) Wifi/Bluetooth you will trow away your 5500 immediately
if you have a C model (much better display, better keyboard,
more memory, more stable software, install Cacko or pdaXrom or Opie).
And you can still use your Bluetooth/WiFi cards you have. |
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External
Since: Jul 22, 2003
Posts: 5
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(Msg. 5) Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2007 8:55 am
Post subject: Re: Recent Linux PDA? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Paul Rubin <http://phr.cx@NOSPAM.invalid> writes:
[...]
> I think of PDA as meaning you that can turn the thing off with
> applications active, and when you turn it back on, you're in the
> same state as before with the same stuff on the screen.
What makes you think you can't do that with the N800 (or 770)? |
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External
Since: Feb 28, 2005
Posts: 3
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(Msg. 6) Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2007 8:55 am
Post subject: Re: Recent Linux PDA? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Bruce Stephens <bruce+usenet@cenderis.demon.co.uk> writes:
> > I think of PDA as meaning you that can turn the thing off with
> > applications active, and when you turn it back on, you're in the
> > same state as before with the same stuff on the screen.
>
> What makes you think you can't do that with the N800 (or 770)?
Can you? I have one of the closeout 770's and I know a guy with an
800 and I haven't seen this capability in either. If the 770 could do
that, I'd expect the default configuration to be set up for it and the
starting docs to describe it. However, I haven't looked into the
situation too closely. |
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External
Since: Nov 22, 2006
Posts: 11
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(Msg. 7) Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2007 10:40 am
Post subject: Re: Recent Linux PDA? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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hns.RemoveThis@computer.org wrote:
> If you want a device with keyboard, there is no alternative to a
> Sharp SL-C1000 or SL-C3200. Although they are physically larger and
> have no (builtin) Wifi/Bluetooth you will throw away your 5500
> immediately if you have a C model (much better display, better
> keyboard, more memory, more stable software, install Cacko or pdaXrom
> or Opie). And you can still use your Bluetooth/WiFi cards you have.
A keyboard of some kind is essential. I supplement the 5500's built-in
one with an FX100 roll-up rubber keyboard which plugs right in. I
haven't found out yet if anything similar exists for the Nokia N800. The
Sharp SL-Cs looks a bit too big and heavy for what I want -- I already
have a laptop.
Chris Cox wrote:
> Nokia? The N800.
That might do the job, provided (as Paul Rubin warns, and Bruce Stephens
hints) that it suspends and resumes without a full reboot, and that they
keyboard is usable. It doesn't mention a shell window, but there seems
to be a repo at maemo.org with bash, joe, and a few other bits and
pieces, and they appear to be .debs. Java and LaTeX would be important,
but should be possible.
Bruce Stephens wrote:
> What makes you think you can't do that with the N800 (or 770)?
Because it doesn't mention it on the web site, and there is no
occurrence of 'suspend' or 'resume' in the site or in the downloadable
PDF doc. Does anyone know if it will do this? Bruce?
Thank you all for the suggestions.
///Peter |
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External
Since: Jul 22, 2003
Posts: 5
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(Msg. 8) Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2007 12:45 pm
Post subject: Re: Recent Linux PDA? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Paul Rubin <http://phr.cx@NOSPAM.invalid> writes:
> Bruce Stephens <bruce+usenet@cenderis.demon.co.uk> writes:
>> > I think of PDA as meaning you that can turn the thing off with
>> > applications active, and when you turn it back on, you're in the
>> > same state as before with the same stuff on the screen.
>>
>> What makes you think you can't do that with the N800 (or 770)?
>
> Can you? I have one of the closeout 770's and I know a guy with an
> 800 and I haven't seen this capability in either. If the 770 could do
> that, I'd expect the default configuration to be set up for it and the
> starting docs to describe it. However, I haven't looked into the
> situation too closely.
Probably there's a difference in expectation and language.
I expect a PDA to have a mode where the device is basically off, but
the memory is still kept active, so it can wake up immediately. I
expect a laptop to be able to do that, too, but I'd also expect it to
be able to suspend to disk, and restart quickly but not immediately.
The N800 (as far as I know) falls into the PDA category in this
respect---I don't think it can suspend to memory card. But yes, it
can do what PDAs do: when you press the power button, the default
option is "Lock touch screen and keys", and that's what I do most of
the time. I imagine that's the way it's intended to be used, though I
agree I don't see any hint in the manual. When in that mode, it'll
wake up immediately. |
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External
Since: Feb 28, 2005
Posts: 3
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(Msg. 9) Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2007 3:24 pm
Post subject: Re: Recent Linux PDA? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Bruce Stephens <bruce+usenet@cenderis.demon.co.uk> writes:
> I expect a PDA to have a mode where the device is basically off, but
> the memory is still kept active, so it can wake up immediately. I
> expect a laptop to be able to do that, too, but I'd also expect it to
> be able to suspend to disk, and restart quickly but not immediately.
>
> The N800 (as far as I know) falls into the PDA category in this
> respect---I don't think it can suspend to memory card. But yes, it
> can do what PDAs do: when you press the power button, the default
> option is "Lock touch screen and keys", and that's what I do most of
> the time. I imagine that's the way it's intended to be used, though I
> agree I don't see any hint in the manual. When in that mode, it'll
> wake up immediately.
Cool. It's possible the 800 is better than the 770 in this regard. I
will check the 770 manual but I don't have the impression that the 770
can do this. I will also ask the guy I mentioned about the 800.
I got the 770 because it was very cheap and I doubt I'd pay what an
800 costs no matter what it does, but it does sound like the 800 is
quite a bit more powerful. Among other things the 800 has two SDHC
slots so it can take up to 32GB of ram (using the still-very-expensive
16GB SDHC cards) making it much more useful as a media player than the
770 (which uses a mini-SD card limited to 2GB).
Sooner or later Nokia will have to make one of these things with a
built in phone, to compete with the Apple phone.
Here is my favorite APhone review (warning, not work safe):
http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=iphone |
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External
Since: May 15, 2007
Posts: 1
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(Msg. 10) Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2007 3:29 am
Post subject: Re: Recent Linux PDA? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Peter Flynn <peter.nosp RemoveThis @m.silmaril.ie> writes:
> I've been using a Sharp Zaurus SL-5000D and then a SL-5500 for years, currently
> running OpenZaurus 3.5.3 (kernel 2.4.1 and Opie 1.2.1. It's been excellent,
> providing pretty much all I have needed so far (calendar/contacts, browser,
> mailer, IR, wifi/bluetooth/RJ45 card, terminal, editor, Java, and LaTeX).
>
> But it won't last forever, and I'm now interested in something similar but
> faster and with more storage and memory. Unfortunately, the market seems to be
> stagnant for Linux on PDAs, and all the web pages I can find mention either
> Sharp's more recent (and physically much larger) systems (still without
> wifi/bluetooth) running their own Linux kludge, or non-native Linux hacked onto
> old WinCE/Palm/etc PDAs, or a MilSpec ruggedized device for $1500+
>
> Is there *any* RECENT (2007) affordable and (preferably) native Linux PDA along
> similar lines to the SL5500 that isn't corporately crippled? I don't mind
> replacing a non-Linux OS with a port of Linux, provided that the port is stable
> and has similar support to how OZ/Opie worked (for a time).
While it is more in the cell phone camp in that it doesn't have a full keyboard
attached (but evidently does have a touch keyboard on the screen), have you
looked at OpenMoko? I recall slashdot talked about it in the July time frame.
It doesn't have 802.11, but perhaps with bluetooth or usb, these could be
added. I don't know if they are on track to provide the wider non-developer
versions that they promised for October:
http://www.openmoko.com/
http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Main_Page
--
Michael Meissner
email: mrmnews RemoveThis @the-meissners.org
http://www.the-meissners.org |
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External
Since: Sep 17, 2007
Posts: 1
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(Msg. 11) Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2007 12:12 pm
Post subject: Re: Recent Linux PDA? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"Peter Flynn" <peter.nosp.RemoveThis@m.silmaril.ie> wrote in message
news:5l2utjF65ndeU1@mid.individual.net...
> I've been using a Sharp Zaurus SL-5000D and then a SL-5500 for years,
> currently running OpenZaurus 3.5.3 (kernel 2.4.1 and Opie 1.2.1. It's
> been excellent, providing pretty much all I have needed so far
> (calendar/contacts, browser, mailer, IR, wifi/bluetooth/RJ45 card,
> terminal, editor, Java, and LaTeX).
>
> But it won't last forever, and I'm now interested in something similar but
> faster and with more storage and memory. Unfortunately, the market seems
> to be stagnant for Linux on PDAs, and all the web pages I can find mention
> either Sharp's more recent (and physically much larger) systems (still
> without wifi/bluetooth) running their own Linux kludge, or non-native
> Linux hacked onto old WinCE/Palm/etc PDAs, or a MilSpec ruggedized device
> for $1500+
>
> Is there *any* RECENT (2007) affordable and (preferably) native Linux PDA
> along similar lines to the SL5500 that isn't corporately crippled? I don't
> mind replacing a non-Linux OS with a port of Linux, provided that the port
> is stable and has similar support to how OZ/Opie worked (for a time).
>
> I'm not in Japan
>
> ///Peter
>
The "Archos 604 wifi" is an MP3 player, picture viewer, video playback (divx
if I recall correctly), ...
It is built around some version of linux although, I believe it is locked
and you cannot easily add applications. You can surf the web with Opera.
This might not be close enough to what you are looking for but I thought I'd
mention it.
SL |
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External
Since: Jul 22, 2003
Posts: 5
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(Msg. 12) Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2007 2:07 pm
Post subject: Re: Recent Linux PDA? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Paul Rubin <http://phr.cx@NOSPAM.invalid> writes:
[...]
> Cool. It's possible the 800 is better than the 770 in this regard. I
> will check the 770 manual but I don't have the impression that the 770
> can do this. I will also ask the guy I mentioned about the 800.
I'd be a bit surprised. What happens if you just leave the 770?
Presumably it goes into some power-saving mode? I think that's
basically all the N800 is doing (though perhaps telling it to saves a
bit more power, since the touch screen is also deactivated).
> I got the 770 because it was very cheap and I doubt I'd pay what an
> 800 costs no matter what it does, but it does sound like the 800 is
> quite a bit more powerful. Among other things the 800 has two SDHC
> slots so it can take up to 32GB of ram (using the still-very-expensive
> 16GB SDHC cards) making it much more useful as a media player than the
> 770 (which uses a mini-SD card limited to 2GB).
In theory, but I'm not sure the supplied kernels support SDHC yet.
> Sooner or later Nokia will have to make one of these things with a
> built in phone, to compete with the Apple phone.
Sooner or later they'll make sure it has PDA-type software like a
calendar, etc. The devices are (IMHO) a bit too big (or the wrong
form, anyway) to be decent PDAs, but really there ought to be standard
software for acting like a PDA, for people who want to use them for
that. |
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Since: Nov 22, 2006
Posts: 11
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(Msg. 13) Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2007 7:15 pm
Post subject: Re: Recent Linux PDA? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Paul Rubin wrote:
> Sooner or later Nokia will have to make one of these things with a
> built in phone, to compete with the Apple phone.
I hope not...the last thing I want is phone capability on my PDA.
Have you ever tried looking up something in a spreadsheet while using
the device as a phone?
///Peter |
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External
Since: Nov 22, 2006
Posts: 11
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(Msg. 14) Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2007 7:17 pm
Post subject: Re: Recent Linux PDA? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Bruce Stephens wrote:
> Sooner or later they'll make sure it has PDA-type software like a
> calendar, etc. The devices are (IMHO) a bit too big (or the wrong
> form, anyway) to be decent PDAs, but really there ought to be standard
> software for acting like a PDA, for people who want to use them for
> that.
You're saying that they don't come with a calendar/contacts app?
That's a killer...or is there one for download?
///Peter |
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External
Since: Nov 22, 2006
Posts: 11
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(Msg. 15) Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2007 7:18 pm
Post subject: Re: Recent Linux PDA? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Michael Meissner wrote:
> While it is more in the cell phone camp in that it doesn't have a full keyboard
> attached (but evidently does have a touch keyboard on the screen), have you
> looked at OpenMoko?
Yes, I did, and in fact I had some email exchanges with them about the
lack of wifi
> I recall slashdot talked about it in the July time frame.
> It doesn't have 802.11, but perhaps with bluetooth or usb, these could be
> added. I don't know if they are on track to provide the wider non-developer
> versions that they promised for October:
> http://www.openmoko.com/
> http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Main_Page
The problem seems to be that they don't know who the market is, and for
functionality it's been overtaken by the iPhone now anyway.
///Peter |
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